Memoirs on the Second Chechen War

By Vestnik Kavkaza

In late winter and early spring Russia marks several tragic dates of the history of the Second Chechen Campaign. Five years ago the Russian authorities announced cancelation of the counter-terrorist operation, but the situation in the North Caucasus is still unstable. Vestnik Kavkaza took interview of participants of those events – Colonel General Sergey Oleynichenko and the head of the press service of the Interior Ministry of Russia, Colonel Abdula Musayev.

Oleyinichenko: The second Chechen war started for us, for the Ministry of Internal Affairs of Dagestan, on August 1, 1999, when a group of militants numbering about 1,500 people entered the Tsumadinsky district. I directly participated in hostilities in neighboring Botlikh district, where we arrived on August 6. These were a difficult few days for us, for the local community, it was a big surprise, the arrival of such a great band. We already had about 2,500 people. In the early days we immediately seized about 6 villages, then a long defense of the Botlikh district began.

Vestnik Kavkaza: Was this a surprise?

Oleyinichenko: War always starts unexpectedly. Although in general, it was not a surprise. The fighting began around the perimeter of the Dagestani border and lasted about six months. The outposts of the interior forces and law enforcement agencies were under attack in the immediate vicinity of the administrative border of Chechnya. There were several such operations conducted against the Dagestani police, against units of the Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of the Interior.

Vestnik Kavkaza: What was the mood of the people of Dagestan at that time?

Oleyinichenko: I do not want to say that the population was panicking. I did not see this. But the people, of course, were suppressed by the fact that the threat came from a neighboring republic, where they didn't expect it. This is the first point. Secondly, the Russian army received extraordinary support from the local population. Local people helped the army in everything. Women brought bread, cooked meat, literally accompanied the soldiers, that is, provided all possible support. There were even cases when individual artillery batteries that fired on the enemy were guarded by the local population. The boys surrounded the battery. That is, there were many such ... At that time, and even now, many believed that anyone who had a gun was a participant in the conflict. I want to say that the real heroes of this conflict were simple people, Dagestan guys, women who did a lot so that this conflict was localized and subsequently eliminated.

Vestnik Kavkaza: When did it become clear that the war was over and the amount of fighting was abating?

Oleyinichenko: About a week later, when the enemy was stopped, they made several attempts to break through the Godoberi Gorge. to pass through the Andi zone, and Basayev tried to persuade the local population to let a large group of militants pass to the rear of the units of the Ministry of Defense. But the local population refused, they did not agree with the role of traitors, behaved very well, in addition, put up serious resistance to the fighters, and there were some fire clashes in the Andi region. There is a resident, who was posthumously awarded the title of Hero of Russia for taking part in the fighting. That is, the local population did not support and also condemned the militants, because in the first Chechen war the population of Andi hid a lot of refugees from Chechnya. They were living with families and wanted for nothing. The Dagestanis of the Botlikh district have always lived modestly. They shared what they had with others. And then a few years later they get a surprise from their neighboring republic.

Vestnik Kavkaza: Why were the First and Second Chechen Wars possible? What was the impetus for this?

Oleyinichenko: In my view, the impetus to all these events was the changes that occurred in the governance structure of the country. Taking the decision to start the war in Chechnya, it was a difficult decision, but in fact this solution was formed much deeper. There were many issues of social and economic problems. I think there are perhaps a hundred factors that influenced the change of situation. Now answering what was the reason to start with is, of course, difficult, and it would be wrong if we mentioned one or two, maybe three reasons. There was a whole set of reasons that had to be addressed. Unfortunately, only one way out of the situation was found - starting a war. This was not the best idea.

Vestnik Kavkaza: How do you assess the results of the two campaigns? Have they led to positive change? Is it hoped that this will not happen again and people will continue to exist peacefully in this region?

Oleyinichenko: Certainly. For so many years, so much effort has been spent and so many lives have been lost. I think that now the situation is very favorable and has a tendency to improve. Look at what is happening in Grozny, it is built up and is a beautiful city. The situation is changing, not only externally but also internally. And in our Dagestan it is changing for the better, whether we like it or not. Some people accept the changes, others do not, but the changes occur.

Musayev: Our republic didn’t know such disasters, since I was born at least. Troubling events on the border with the Chechen Republic had always taken place. You know our administrative border is 500 km, and 10 districts of Dagestan border the Chechen Republic. Of course it would be wrong to say that it was unexpected. Of course various provocations were expected, but not a wide-scale tragedy. When the First Chechen Campaign took place, in 1994 Dagestan accepted 70, 000 people officially and the same number unofficially. They lived with our families. When the Second Chechen Campaign began, they moved from Dagestan to Ingushetia. There were temporary towns, villages, they lived in tents, but in Dagestan they lived in houses. That is why it was very offensive for us that people who found a refuge here… What did they think about? Whom did they listen to? They attacked Dagestan with such a big group, several thousand people. They probably thought that Dagestan would shift on their side. The events in the Karamakhin zone had been building up. It seemed they would start in the Botlikhsky district, in the Tsumadinsky district, then would go down to the Laksky district, Khasavyurt, and the rest would be for sure. Of course it didn’t happen. The history of Dagestan hasn’t seen its conquering, and our people fought as a solid union that time. It was the biggest uniting factor for our people. The authorities, the interior ministry where I was working in the press service, began the operation at once. We were dispersed – some in Botlikh, others in Tsumada, some in the Karamakhin zone – all over the republic. A timely press center was organized, which I headed on August 7, 1999. Every day an enormous number of journalists came from various places. There were no fewer foreign journalists than ours. They watched what was happening. Our main force was our people. Armaments don’t always win, if there is no people’s spirit. The spirit of Dagestanis was transfered to the soldiers who came to help us. The Interior Ministry, the Defense Ministry – all together we managed to win the enemy.

Vestnik Kavkaza: What do you think the results of the First and the Second Chechen Wars are? What do you expect from the situation in the region at the moment?

Musayev: There will be no repetition. First, we have to analyze what was happening then and what is happening now. The authorities of the country at that period composed armed forces in Chechnya, I don’t know why. Today the situation is different. There are no armed forces in any republic. What is happening now is a struggle against militants. This process is natural, unfortunately, but it expanded in such a wide way, that it has to be reduced. Nothing can be done in one minute. There are forces which support militants, they have a structure. Probably it is not powerful, but it really exists and we cannot ignore this. We see its expression from time to time. Unfortunately, these expressions are an explosion in Khasavyurt; they negatively influence the general environment of Dagestan and the whole country.

Vestnik Kavkaza: Why does a small conflict burn in the region?

Musayev: There are many factors. We cannot say it is about the West or someone else. Unfortunately, we are fighting against our own guys. If we take Dagestan, Dagestanis are on both sides. They are of the same age. It is the biggest problem today – the conflicts are inside one and the same republic, region. They are not huge, but for every family, every residential area they are tragedies. I return to Khasavyurt, the explosion was so huge that people began to think it all was organized. It is not organized, groups are dispersed, but they do not stop. Unfortunately, they work with young people. There are many factors: absence of jobs, employment, and so on. When everything is added together, one understands where the support comes from. But the West doesn’t sleep either. “The West” – I mean figuratively. These are foreign forces – the West and the East. There are too many forces which wish destabilization us. Not inside, but abroad. But it is not well organized, as you may think. But it still exists. That is why we face such cases sometimes. It is timely. Compare it with what it was like 5,7,10 years ago – it is dying out.

Vestnik Kavkaza: Can we speak about the religious aspect, movements in Islam which provoke people and make them warlike?

Musayev: There is nothing in common with religion in terrorist attacks. Religion doesn’t accept violence. It is pseudo-religion. Some are hiding behind this mask, others – behind another mask. There is no religious trap. The Muslim religion doesn’t give a right to kill a human.