Michael Lotem: "Three years in Azerbaijan were the most exciting and interesting in my life"

Pyotr Lyukimson, Israel, exclusively for VK

Israeli diplomat Michael Lotem recently stopped being the Israeli ambassador to Azerbaijan and returned to his home country. What are his impressions of Azerbaijan and how in his view will the relations between the two countries develop? These questions will be answered in an interview by Michael Lotem to VK

-       Mr Lotem, how did you feel when you were appointed to Azerbaijan? Was it something like an "honorable exile"?

-       Definitely not. Already when working in Vienna in the early 2000s I became interested in Azerbaijan. This interest continued while I was  working in Eastern Europe and the CIS countries. When I received myappointment to Azerbaijan I felt that I knew where I was going.  But I could not expect that it would be that interesting. The three years in Azerbaijan were without any doubt the most exciting and interesting years of my life. I regret only that I could not stay there for longer.

-       What surprised you the most when you came to Azerbaijan?

-       As I say, I worked both in Western and Eastern Europe. Before coming to Azerbaijan I had been to Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan. But still Baku with its unique architecture where West meets East shocked me. I did not expect it. It is indeed one of the most beautiful cities in the world with a very intense cultural life.  Honestly, not all countries can host those musicians that come to Baku.  I will never forget how soon after my arrival to Baku I went to listen to the Israeli Symphony Orchestra conducted by Zubin Meta.  The hall was full, and one could immediately see how sophisticated this audience was. The other surprise was the range of questions I had to deal with as an ambassador.  Usually it is much more narrow. Depending on the character of the relations between the countries, it can be political relations, propaganda, reports, cultural exchange. In Baku I had to deal with everything - culture, economy, security, political questions - because the relations between the two countries were developing very intensively. It was hard but interesting.

-       As far as I understand the development was most intense during your term there?

-       No, it is not really so. The turning point was the visit of Shimon Peres to Azerbaijan that took place two months before my appointment. But there is no doubt that in the last two years the connections between our countries became more active, and it is partly a result of the positive changes brought into Israeli foreign politics by the current FM Avigdor Liberman. He realized the importance of developing relations with Eastern Europe and the CIS countries, including the Caucasus and Central Asia. It was also a big step forward in developing Israeli relations with the Muslim world.

-       I often heard that Azerbaijan cannot really be considered a Muslim country.

-       I disagree. Azerbaijan is an Islamic state.  But it is an Islamic state that deconstructs the existing stereotype that all Muslims, Shia or Sunni, dream only about murdering a Jew. While most Muslims do not feel that way. The existence of Azerbaijan proves how different the situation is when religion is not a mere instrument for politics. Azerbaijan is an Islamic country whose residents keep their religious traditions. For instance, it is very difficult to find there a shop or a restaurant with pork. Religious holidays are celebrated.  I would say that the influence of Islam on the daily practices and values is much stronger than in Kazakhstan. Still, Azerbaijan does not use religion as a political instrument. This unique historical experience deserves respect.

-       Have you met any religious leaders of Azerbaijan?

-       No, but I had friendly relations with Dr. Rafik Aliyev, who was the head of the committee for religious affairs. He knows Islam very well, he personally met sheikhs and all the other important Islamic figures of Azerbaijan, he helped me to better understand Islam and believe that it is important to have dialogue with some leaders of Islam.

-       During these three years you must have met some ordinary Azeri and politicians. What image of Azeri people do you have? What in your view are the features of the Azeri national character?

-       You know, when you asked me about what surprised me the most,  I was too quick to answer. Azeri people surprised me the most. On the one hand, you meet the Azerbaijani intelligentsia, educated in the Soviet years, and their erudition, depth and open-mindedness cannot escape your attention. This is the old intelligentsia that managed to accept the new ideas and in a way defines the development of Azerbaijan. Some people say that Azerbaijan is moving towards the west, but I do not think so. Azerbaijan is working on its own model of society and wants to occupy (and in some respects occupies) its own place in the world. On the other hand. Azerbaijan has outstanding young people, educated abroad, who are ready to continue the way of the older generation.

-       Do you mean the new generation of the Azerbaijani politicians and diplomats?

-       Not only. Azerbaijan now has a new generation of businessmen, also very well-educated, able to think in the long-term prospect instead of only immediate profit. I indeed met many Azerbaijani politicians. And all the time I was impressed by their personalities. I will not mention names, but contemporary Azerbaijani politics has many bright figures. I was convinced that many of them deserved their positions and are good specialists in their fields.

-       Have you met President Ilham Aliyev?

-       Sure. He is a big friend of our people. Maybe one of the biggest.

-       Recently several Israeli ministers visited Baku, and you were responsible for the organization of this. Did it always go smoothly?

- Indeed the organization of a visit often causes a lot of troubles for an ambassador, who needs to solve a lot of questions. But in Baku the Azerbaijani side often solved most of these questions, and the reception of the guests was above all our expectations. It was fantastic.  Do you remember how our minister of agriculture Orit Nuked came to Azerbaijan. There were also ministers of agriculture from the other countries, but it was clear that Mrs Nuked received special treatment.  I met the same warm and helpful attitude whenever I addressed the ministries with certain questions. Of course it was a reflection of their attitude to Israel.

- Why do think this attitude is so good? Is it because Azerbaijan is interested in buying Israeli weapons?

- Of course one can give such an explanation, have this "conspiracy theory" or put everything down to one factor. Of course both countries have their own practical interests, because this is how relations work. But there is no doubt that the connection between the two countries developed as a result of multiple factors. The most important is that our worldview and evaluation of events is very similar.  Americans can say that they love us, and so do we, but they will never fully accept us as theirs. And the same with us.  The same with Europeans - some distance always remains. With Azerbaijan everything is different.  Even if there are some disagreements, you still feel that you talk with somebody like you, whose opinions and expectations are similar.  It is particularly felt in business because there are fewer sharp corners than in politics.

- When you mention a similar worldview, do you mean mentality or ideology?

- Both. Similar mentalities produce similar political evaluations and expectations. Both our peoples know how to stand on the ground but look in the sky. Both want peace. We have similar values and moral standards. Finally, Israel and Azerbaijan are very important to each other from strategic and tactical point of view. A big role is played by the historical factor. It is not fashionable in politics to forget the past. What is gone, is gone, let's start anew. It is often done because the past has some traps. Azeris and Jews have a common history of friendship and interactions. And both sides understand it.

- How do the Israeli-Arab conflict and the tensions with Turkey influence the relations between Israel and Azerbaijan?

- If there is any influence, it is very indirect. At least I never felt that it is important.  I hear that the good relations with Israel are important for Azerbaijan to gain the support of the US. This is ridiculous. They do not need us to develop relations with the US, they manage perfectly well without us. Same as we do not need Azerbaijan as an instrument to develop some other relations. When this is the basis of the relations, they can be destroyed by any external factor. But both Azerbaijan and Israel value bilateral relations per se, and this determines their stability. Certainly Azerbaijan wants us to settle our relations with Turkey as soon as possible, because the current situation creates a lot of problems because there are some projects involving all three countries. Of course Baku wants a resolution of the Arab-Israeli conflict, because it will give Azerbaijan greater freedom of action in the Islamic world. The same can be said about the Azerbaijani-Armenian conflict. Israel will feel itself much freer when this conflict is resolved.  But I will repeat, that our countries are now so important to each other, that these factors do not influence the character of our relations.

- You say "now". Can it happen that when the power in Azerbaijan or Israel changes, the interstate relations will also change dramatically?

- While in Azerbaijan I talked to very different people, went to shops and markets. I was often recognized on the streets. But I never encountered open anti-Israeli sentiments. Quite the opposite - people were positive about our country. The same attitude I met in the political circles. I think that the attitude towards Israel is not politically-dependent, and the same can be said about our attitude towards Azerbaijan.

- How useful will the Azerbaijani experience be for you in the future?

- I was offered to deal with the energy sector within the Foreign Ministry. I will need to develop international connections, attract investments  - so we will learn how to do things that Azerbaijan has already forgotten.

- But the world press often says that Azerbaijan is addicted to the "oil needle"...

- Oil has been and will be the axis of the Azerbaijani economy for a while, it is the center, and it is natural. On the other hand, the government sees this problem and looks for ways to resolve it. If before the budget money was spent on short-term economic needs, in the last years a lot is invested in human resources, in  education. I see here the basis of the future prosperity of the republic.