Berlin does not believe that the relationship between Moscow and Ankara can create an alternative to the partnership in the NATO framework, the head of the Foreign Minister of Germany, Frank-Walter Steinmeier, said in an interview with the German tabloid Bild, which was published on August 9th – the day of the meeting between Putin and Erdogan. In the interview Steinmeier also touched on other important issues of world politics. Vestnik Kavkaza publishes a translation of the interview.
- The war in Syria, the coup in Turkey, terror attacks – one crisis follows another. Can you disconnect from all this while you are on vacation?
- The disconnect button does not work in this stormy world. But it is worth trying. This year I will be engaged in mountaineering once again. This helps me to distance myself from everything and recharge my strength. For a few hours you are just thinking about the next ten steps you will make and what to grab.
- As in politics – to move forward cautiously, balancing over the abyss?
- In the mountains at least you have climbing protection.
- Politicians make speeches and negotiate. And in Syria people are dying in a brutal war. Is politics really powerless?
- It is not powerless, but we cannot end the fighting just by an order. If it was so, the civil war would not be continuing for a fifth year. What is happening in Syria is a tragedy. There can hardly be even more brutal images than the ones we get from Aleppo. A cruel game for power has been ongoing in the region. And some players are not currently interested in ending the conflict.
- Do you mean the dictator Assad, Russia and Iran?
- And others. Unfortunately, this is also true for many other sides of this conflict.
- So is the world again passively watching?
- You are not very familiar with my work schedule, or John Kerry’s and other colleagues. What do we do day and night? We are constantly looking for ways to persuade the sides of the conflict to negotiate. Look at the situation in which ISIS (the terrorist organization ‘Islamic State’ is banned in Russia) is in Iraq today, and compare it with the summer of 2014. Then it seemed that soon the whole country would be in the hands of the terrorist groups, and all the life, except that of ISIS, would be destroyed. But today there is progress. ISIS has lost half of the territory it controlled since last year. Cities such as Ramadan and Tikrit were liberated and people returned there.
- But before this cancer will be defeated, it is going to spread its metastases in the form of terrorists around the world ...
- ISIS takes responsibility for all the crimes of individuals, who are sometimes more, sometimes to a lesser extent related to the terrorist organization. But I believe that their appeal and potential for recruitment of young people in Europe is not as strong today as in the past year. The number of those who joined the jihad has also decreased significantly.
- ... And in the end will the dictator Assad be the winner in Syria?
- I believe that this is possible. During the transition period, the associates of Assad can play a certain role in Syria. But the political future of the country must be and will be decided without Assad.
- Why does the West not put more pressure on Moscow so it stops supporting the Assad regime?
- We do not build illusions about Russia's role in Syria. But it is impossible to put an end to the civil war in Syria without Moscow. As well as without Iran, Saudi Arabia or Turkey.
- How high is the danger that Turkey together with Russia will create a new military alliance?
- Well, it is good that after the destruction of the Russian combat aircraft by Turkey last year, today once again convergence is observed in the relations between Turkey and Russia. At the same time I do not think that the relationship between the two countries will be so close that Russia will be able to offer Turkey an alternative to the NATO partnership. Turkey is an important partner for NATO – and it should be in the future.
- So do we have to be friendly with the Turkish President Erdogan, even if he turns into a dictator?
- That's bullshit! We have demonstrated our position on the arrests of teachers, judges and journalists from the very beginning, and we are not going to change our position. But despite all the legitimate criticism of the authorities in Turkey, we have to admit (and this is disregarded in the debate in Germany) that those who carried out the coup acted against civilians, against the Parliament with very great cruelty. So consider the Turks and those who are not the supporters of the ruling AKP. Therefore, it is important to emphasize that we have clearly condemned the coup attempt, and a political and criminal investigation of these events should be carried out – but in the legal field only!
- That is, will there be a visa-free regime for Turks who want to visit the EU?
- The abolition of the visa regime will take place when the conditions associated with it will be met. Currently this has not happened yet.
- Let us take a look at the US: Do you fear President Trump?
- The advisors and associates of Donald Trump spend a lot of time trying to soften and smooth out his regular attacks against Hispanics, women, Muslims and soldiers' families. I have a feeling that Trump often does not know what he really wants. He says he wants to make America stronger, but at the same time he wants America to recede. How this can be combined is beyond my comprehension. The world is incredibly complex. It needs leaders who are aware of their own responsibility. They help to improve the world. We do not need politicians who make the world more dangerous.
- By the time of the elections to the Bundestag in 2017 you will have had 8 years of work in the post of foreign minister under your belt. Would you like to continue your work for another 4 years if the election results allow?
- I've been doing foreign policy with great diligence and I believe that with perseverance and thought we can change many things for the better. But now a whole year of work is in front of me, which, I believe, will also be difficult. The voters will decide what will be next.
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